Fried Chicken

S4_Episode 34 Southern Fried Chicken

Fried chicken, also known as Southern Fried chicken, although we would never say that here. It's just fried chicken, which is simply breaded chicken parts that have been deep fried. Now that's the simple way of putting it, but the path to getting the meat to retain juices and the breading seasoned perfectly to add crispness and flavor, that is worth a discussion. Meet us at the table as we discuss fried chicken

I'm Lainie and I'm Laura Beth. And we are Steel Magnolias, the strength of steel with the grace of a magnolia. We are here to have uplifting conversations about life in the south.

And we've got plenty of room at our table, So pull up a chair.

Welcome back to the table. The table that we have moved back from the Franklin theatre where we positioned it last week in front of 300 people. That that was just the wildest experience we've had to date, so fun. Yeah, the table legs got all dusted off and cleaned and made shiny so it would look good on the stage. It looked so pretty up there so yes, if you were there live and in person you got to see it but hopefully you got to catch our episode last week with our interview and I wanted to mention that we also launched merch for the event. Cute merch, really cute merch. Cozy merch.  The feedback people were sending me a couple pictures in it are like this is the comfiest sweatshirt I've ever owned. It's not just a cute color, it is cozy, really cute color. It's a kind of a deep, bluish greenish color called Atlantic green. That's the sweatshirt, we have a T shirt and we have a tea towel. All with our signature Peace be with y’all.  The Tea towel is Christmassy though, and it is precious. So cute. So for those that were not able to be at our event, we are going to make those available to you to purchase online. You can do that now through our website. So I'll put the link in the show notes. If anybody wants to pick those up for yourself or for a gift this season.

How in the world have we not done an episode in four seasons on fried chicken?

So this was your idea, And I'm like, have we not done that yet, in four years? Well, it’s not you know, it comes up but we've never done a dedicated episode on it. So, there’s a lot to go over. And I'm still learning y'all, by the way.

Well, I'm looking to her as the one that's going to talk about the specifics on actually frying it. But I'm just curious. Before we even get in our topic, what do you think of when you hear or think of fried chicken?

Oh, I love that question. I think of Sunday supper, like a heavier meal on a relaxed day. And I don't think I'm alone in thinking of Sunday supper because I even think about certain menus like at Cracker Barrel. Yeah, they have Sunday fried chicken on Sunday. That's something that they don't have the other days. I've seen that on other menus too, where they'll call it Sunday fried chicken. But that's what I think of. Yeah, it's like an after church meal on a relaxed afternoon, right. Which we've done an episode on Sunday dinner. Yes. Which is lunch. And supper on a platter or in a bucket like yeah, no, like I think of it like how it all is just positioned together, not on an individual plate for some reason that's how I visualize it.  Like the turkey at Thanksgiving basically. Yeah, like presentation is big. And yeah. Well, I you know, I'm with you. I think of it as like comfort food. Definitely. For sure. I think of The Help. I know I mentioned movies on here a lot but I just think of that scene, Minnie don't burn no chicken. Exactly. That is the quote that I have in my notes here. But the scene that comes from is so cute, because it's, you know, so Minnie, being the maid/ the help, and she had been doing all the cooking for the white woman and she'd been keeping it a secret from the husband of the house. And the white woman says, Oh, well he might figure out that I've not been that I've been doing all this cooking because he knows I can't cook so maybe we should burn some. And that's when Minnie says, Minnie don't burn no chicken. I love that movie so much. Then I think just some of the I'm gonna call them fads of fried chicken being incorporated into at all sorts of restaurants, the chicken and waffles, or do you know what I mean? That's her, which I do like chicken and waffles, by the way, but it feels Yeah, I don't know how. I don't know if chicken and waffles is gonna stand the test of time. Like it feels a little bit like trendy to you. Yeah, yeah, that's fair. And KFC.

I think the other thing, yes, yes. So that's a, we'll get into that later. Okay. So let's just talk you fried chicken, you even fried chicken in celebration of our live event celebration that we had last week. That's right. And even that's kind of a funny thing. A lot of people now the trendy thing is to have champagne and fried chicken. Did you know that?

Oh, I can see that. But no, I still think of a Pinot Noir when I think of fried chicken for some reason.

Yeah. So we you know, we're kind of doing a little double celebration. I had a birthday at the end of October. And we just wanted to sort of have a coming together a post event time from the podcast. So you fried chicken. This past week? I did.

And I can go over my process. But like I said, I'm still learning and it really encourages me sometimes when I've seen like interviews of a Sean Brock or somebody who you think of as mastered all things Southern cooking. And he says it still keeps him up at night sometimes. Wow. How to, you know, get it just right. Sure. Sure. And I loved your intro in that you do want the moisture on the inside, but the reading right on the outside and that's not an easy thing to master.

I got that from watching you and your process this week. Trent you were I could tell you're trying to master both of those things. Yeah.

So and we do times it does better than others that I can't always measure either. Like what was it that made it?

Yeah, there's too many factors. 

But anyway, we did do some video that I'll either do an Instagram real or do something with your showing preparation. Yeah. If you're not already follow us on Instagram at Steel Magnolias podcast. That's where I'll be putting up some of that stuff this week that? 

Well, let's start I guess with buying chicken at the grocery store. What are we buying? So I do find now not to go negative because this is uplifting conversations about life in the south. But it's really hard to get things the way you want them sometimes in the grocery store when the employees don't really want to be there. They don't care and they don't know. So in meaning like the person behind the meat counter doesn't really want to have to cut meat. For some reason, it seems to me on the few times that I've had to ask for something. Wow, not every single one right? But often that's the case. And so we're in a world of people liking a lot of boneless chicken now. Yes and Lainie don't cook no boneless chicken when she's frying it. Yeah, top any may not burn any but I want bone in because bone in chicken is way more flavorful, right. That's not boneless.

That's not a Lainie preference, you can ask any chef that. Yes. I'm sorry. That is not my truth, that is THE truth.

Okay, so and so you're saying even talking to the butcher about cutting up a whole chicken because it's hard to find the bone in already prepped out on the shelves. So that what you're saying so so I used to see where you would see like a long rectangular platter that had two legs, two thighs, two wings. You know the brand. Yeah. You know, that's just what you want are those parts. And so now what I typically say if they have bone in chicken, okay? It's like here's four humongous breast. Here's, yes, six or eight thighs.

So you're getting all of one part. Okay,

so if you're wanting to cook for a crowd that likes different parts, right? I'm at like $60 because I've just had to buy I've invested so much in eat. Yeah. Do you see what I'm saying? That many of everything instead of like a chicken cut up. So really hard to find the parts for a family or to or it'd be like for a huge crowd. You could do that. Yeah. Okay, that makes sense. And then sometimes they'll have a whole chicken but then the person behind the meat counter and I'm not using the word butcher because I don't think they think of themselves as that. A butcher obviously will do it for sure. But this person that's just Yeah, they're just sort of there to tag the meat. Yeah. Or Yes. That's kind their they don't want to have they don't want that. Yeah. And in all truthfulness, I don't want to have to do it either because I don't really know what I'm doing. Exactly. And I have said this on the podcast before I get a little grossed out with cartilage and sure bones and things that I think a lot of you, I would say the same. So I like it already cut. Yeah, yeah. Okay, so let's say we found what we want your bone in parts of chicken. Yes. Hopefully a variety.

Yes. And so I think one of the important steps in frying chicken is to get that moisture to stay inside, you need to put it in a brine. Okay. And there's lots of different recipes for different brines out there. But think like the difference of you know, when you go to Chick fil A and how moist that chicken is so moist, yeah, they have it in a brine. Okay, they use some kind of a pickle brine. Okay, they are that okay. And so that's why it's so moist. So moist. Yeah. So you're talking about a wet brine? Yes. I'm sorry. Yes. A wet brine that is mostly salt based. Okay, because the salt gets in there and makes it hold moisture. Nice. Okay. And so I'm happy to share the recipe I use. Yeah, but mine is lemons. Bailey leaves. flat leaf parsley, thyme, Clover, honey, garlic, black peppercorns, kosher salt, water, all of that in a big old pot. Yes. And you bring it all to a boil? Yeah. The recipe I have is for two gallons. That is for cooking10 pounds of chicken. So I usually don't make that much. Did you make about half that? Yeah. Okay. All right. So when they see this online, I'm just giving reference point for that. Okay. And this is at least a day in advance, right? Yeah. So that's one of the things too is you can't really spring fried chicken on me, because I needed just a two day process to get all of this together. So once you put it in this brine, well, okay, you make the brine, you bring it to a boil, but you let it cool completely all the way down. Because you wouldn't want to put meat in hot brine because it's gonna start cooking. Yeah. So let it cool all the way down. And then you're gonna put your chicken in that for up to 12 hours. And are we putting it in the fridge and you're putting it in the fridge for up to 12 hours up to 12 hours in that brine. Not longer than that, or it's gonna start getting too salty. Okay. But 12 hours is good. And that's what I did was exactly 12 hours. So let it cool down. I put the chicken in it like 10 at night, knowing that by 10 The next morning, I could take it out. Okay, so then you completely discard all that, Brian, it's going to be kind of yucky looking through, get rid of all of that clean your chicken off because like ransom little prints and bits of baby leaves or peppercorns are stuck on it. You cleaned all of that off. And then in my situation, I wasn't cooking it till the afternoon. So I cleaned it all off and then put it back in the fridge. Okay, but you it's ready to go to start cooking at that point. Yes. And no matter what you're doing with chicken, you can brine it. Like if you're roasting it sure it ever it's gonna help. Yes, because now it's got its moisture in there.

Then I love this next part because I think this is so pro talk about your bowl system. Okay, well, so the next thing I want to say though, is it's good to get your chicken down to room temperature before you start doing the next thing. Okay, and that can take like an hour. Yeah. So leave it just sit now for about an hour. Okay, so it's getting back down to room temperature. And then I do this little bowl system. So I have three bowls. Bowl one in three, or four the breading in a bowl to is for my buttermilk, okay. And so what I do is I put flour, and then my seasonings together. And you know, whatever. If you have a recipe that you like better, just however you want to do it. You can still do this bowl system if you would like but I do flour, garlic powder, onion powder, paprika, cayenne, a little salt and pepper. And I do the same amounts in bowls one and three can just mix it up. Okay. And so the flour still looks pretty white. Sure, but maybe you might see a little bit of speckles Yeah, with those flavors. So I'll take the chicken part, put it in bowl one kind of gets a little coating on there. And then I dip it in the buttermilk, which is now kind of sealing that in a little bit, let some of that drip off and then put it in bowl three, four more to stick to now even better flour so that it's really nice and covered. Yeah. And then I'll just sit it on a piece of parchment paper or something ready to go in the hot oil. Right. Well thought right to do that with all your pieces. Yeah. And then we're going to start to put it in the oil. Yep. Now to put it in the oil. You want your oil already hot.

What oil? What's the oil?

Good question. So the oil that you can use peanut oil, canola oil, vegetable oil, some people like lard. Okay, yeah, um, you know, just Yeah. Shortening or Crisco or something like that. I used vegetable oil the other day because that's what I had. Okay, but I have used canola or peanut before too. Okay. And I some people like to cook it like in a deep fryer. I don't have a deep fryer. So I use about I feel my braiser dish with about a third to a half of the depth of it with oil. Yeah. And so I'm gonna have to cook one side and then flip. Yeah, so it's, it's literally boiling hot. Right? Do you have a temperature gauge that you put in do have a little temperature gauge and you want it at about 320 degrees. So really hot. Okay, so have an apron on. Yeah, if you're Yeah, you know, you it's gonna sometimes splatter a little there's no way around that really. Okay. So you get your oil hot. And I will say that the dark meat and the smaller pieces are going to cook faster trip and your big breast white meat pieces are going to cook so I like to do all the all of one and then maybe crank the heat up even a little more to get it even hotter for the woods your pieces. What's your estimation on a smaller to medium piece on how long it would cook? How long total it would fry? Are we talking 10 minutes. So, typically, it'll say like, if you look at a recipe, it'll say seven or eight minutes each side. Okay, I could get longer than that. Okay, surely you can always get a look at it meat thermometer to check Yeah, you want once it's out and you put a meat thermometer into the center you wanted it like 165, that standard Yeah, so just for safe and so for a big piece we're talking what 25 minutes while 30 minutes so I guess a deep fryer might be faster because it's going all the way in well yeah, I'm having to flip. Yeah, that he's gonna play into the KFC story I'm gonna share here in a minute. Yeah, yeah. It seriously it's time is of the essence for a lot of these places. So that’s true. Yeah, so that's what I do. 

And then I like to have a paper towel lined like a baking sheet or something sheet to soak up some of the oil when I put it out on that and you did such a pretty job putting on a plate with like fresh herbs rosemary and thyme. I think they call it poultry, poultry or so. Yeah. And yes, the thyme rosemary and sage and it looked does look pretty good. Either platter that you put it on.

Well, it's delicious, eat it with your hands no need to put out a survey night that because we had Miss Rachel from England here who hasn't probably had a ton of fried chicken. And she asked for a knife and I'm like happy to get you a knife but just so you know. It's perfectly fine to pick up fried chicken. Yes. And eat it with your hands. Yes. I wonder. Yeah, I mean, okay, so let me just start talking about the international sort of touch that she might have had I saw plenty of KFC s when I was in Europe. In Spain I believe KFC is the most numerous fast food in the world. That sounds about right and that Asians love KFC it is the by far most popular fast food you'll see throughout China. Wow. They love it. So we're talking Kentucky Fried Chicken, the iconic old man with his glasses, Colonel Sanders white goatee. Yeah, so Colonel Sanders, he had a troubled childhood and after losing his father at just the age of five, his mom had to go to work to provide for their family. And therefore, he started taking care of his siblings. Okay, and so he was cooking a lot. Yeah, she showed him we you know the base way. To cook and things to make, but he was cooking more than the average 10-11 year old kid was. And so he actually left home at age 12 to work on a farm. And then he went through lots of jobs trying to figure out what he was going to do or probably see what could make him the most money. I don't know he was a painter. He was a fireman, a ploughman, a streetcar conductor, a ferryboat operator and insurance salesman, justice of the peace and a service station operator. How's that for a resume? Wow, I thought I'd tried a lot of things. So we are talking about a little area of Kentucky, that is Corbin Kentucky. It was 1929. And he opened his it was really a gas station. And that was where he began to cook for the occasional customer in the back room. There just kind of started to be a need for food while filling up. And so he knew how to cook. And so he started doing this now as somebody sitting here at age 41. It's very interesting to me to hear that Colonel Sanders really got cracking it about age 49. Really? Yeah, yeah. I mean, because you heard all the list of jobs. Those weren't all 6 month stents. You know. And so yeah, so if you if you look at when KFC was incorporated, he was 65. Wow, he lived to age 90. So he did see a good bit of its, you know, wild success but back to the gas station, where it's taking him around 30 minutes to cook fried chicken. Okay, which was a significant problem for I mean, but that's yeah, that's normal. Right? But how are you gonna do it quickly right um, someone is on a lunch break. Exactly. Or when they're just there for they thought they were here for gas but oh, you've got food all late and get some fried chicken Oh, it's gonna be 30 minutes now I'm late, you know kind of thing, but that was his most popular menu item is the fried chicken. And so to tackle this problem, right necessity is the motherhood of event inventions. He used a pressure cooker instead of deep frying the chicken and that cut down the time to about eight to nine minutes and it helped him sell more fried chicken. So he continued to experiment with his chicken recipe, and in 1938, he finally perfected the fried chicken recipe. The recipe included 11 herbs and spices which to this day are guarded as a secret by KFC. And as of this year 2022. There are at least 25,000 KFC restaurants in 145 countries. Wow. That is like the American dream. It really is. So it was birthed out of a gas station because I'm telling you there's some gas stations with some good fried chicken. Absolutely. So that's kind of fine. Yeah, right. I've also thought about like sometimes when you've walked in a gas station and you leave smelling like they've been frying food. Yeah, like there's no way around that smell sometimes.

So just while we're on the sort of the topic of chain restaurants I did want to mention, Popeyes also has extremely good fried chicken, they're a chain. Publix grocery stores for real really good fried chicken for their fried chicken. It's funny that you mentioned that he said 30 minutes because I went to get some bone in fried chicken. They do both I do the tenders that are boneless. Yeah. Not as good I'm telling you. Yeah get Publix is bone in fried chicken. Yeah, but I went in and they were out of it. And they said we'll have more in 30 minutes. Oh, how funny. I guess I'll get a couple of groceries I was planning on it but me like Well at least I know I'm doing it right. And then I had I miss so bad Mrs. Winners biscuits. Are those chicken aware now so well, just in you know, in thinking back any gathering where chicken was being brought to something whether it was a family gathering or a soccer after game sort of picnic or whatever. We brought Mrs. Winners a lot when I was growing up, and so and they had the most amazing biscuits and gravy but in thinking through this episode, I was like Where are Mrs. Winners now? Like are they completely gone because ours have the one we had in Brentwood has been gone for a long time. And it looks like they are trying to make a little bit of a resurgence. Okay, there are locations and I'll link to them in the show notes. Tennessee only has one right now and it's in Cleveland. That's is close to Chattanooga, but Georgia had a handful of them. And, you know, there was, you know, 20-25 locations that I saw smatterings of so they are still out there. So if you are near one and you haven't tried Mrs. Winners, that's my choice. For sure. But no Memphis birthed a great fried chicken. Yes to Yes. Not. Not a chain in the chain that that we're talking about. But yes, see, but Gus’s world famous fried chicken. They do and it tops a lot of lists. If you look on different you know who's got the best restaurants southern fried chicken. Barbecue in out of Houston, Texas is one that I found on a couple of lists. That's supposedly really good, as well as Martha Lou's kitchen in Charleston and Willie Mays Scotch house in New Orleans. Popeyes didn't make anybody's list. Well, I'm just talking about kind of the individual not the big chain. Oh, gotcha. Gotcha. Yeah, but no public I've heard of Martha Lou Popeyes and Publix are in KFC are always on people's list. There was there's a Southern Living list that includes lots of different categories. Oh, good fried chicken. So like hit new places that are doing fried chicken or you know what I mean? Yeah, Husk here in Nashville's kind of supposed to be really good for their fried chicken. I think

yeah. Oh, for sure, that is Sean Brock. Well, um, No shame if you want to just go pick up some yummy fried chicken and put some sage and thyme and rosemary. Right. That's right. Like you did it. That's right. Or if you want to serve it with waffles, if you're that's into making it with doing the chicken and waffles like we described, I do think that there's something so wonderful about the salty fried chicken with the sweetness of syrup. I get that and you do put syrup on it just like you would if you were just eating a waffle and you know we've mentioned we did an episode on sorghum and sorghum is what Sean Brock brines his chicken in Okay, when he made chicken he does a salt sorghum brine. And I've seen I have one recipe I did it once. I didn't like it as much but it was molasses/ salt brine just to try it. Yes, it was good but I'm like just a salty lemony brine No, I really liked the lemon and then through talk about filling oh my goodness fried chicken alone can fill you up well that's another reason for some reason. I think it's perfect on a Sunday it's yes feels like the day you want to have a big meal and then take a short nap. That sounds wonderful even now.   

We also need to mention Nashville hot chicken. Okay, so you know I mean, I think you and I kind of still think it's funny to hear Nashville associated with hot chicken but alas, here we are. Yeah, we have a lot of foods in this city. But for some reason Nashville hot chicken has risen to the top and become what we are known for fried chicken that the African American community has taken to the next level is really what we're talking about as the origins of hot chicken. Yeah. And that's just cayenne pepper making it hot. It I mean, it literally comes out with a reddish hue. Hundred percent red Renu and I looked up a recipe just to see how do they make that because it looks like it's thick. Sure. And ya know how. So this recipe that I have here from this cookbook is Nashville hot based. And it's three tablespoons of cayenne pepper, two tablespoons of light brown sugar, one teaspoon of garlic powder, one teaspoon of paprika, one tablespoon of onion powder, but this is what I thought was so fascinating. All of that with one cup of the hot frying oil from your batch of fried chicken. So you're putting more oil on it, which is and it's gonna be red because once you've put all that cayenne in and everything but yeah, yeah, and it's liquid so it's almost like you're painting it makes sense. Yeah, this slice and I know it prints is they have like, you know different degrees of heat. And I think medium is what they recommend if you if you're new lazy. Yeah, you know, I would be on the lightest of light. They do. Not just hot but extra hot. Yeah. And I know I am out. I would be that like Dumb and Dumber moment where they're just, they've had the red hots, that they're squirt in their tongue with mustard. It's so hot. And you mentioned Prince’s Prince’s is the original hot chicken that's been serving chicken for over 70 years. In 2013. The James Beard Foundation named princes as an American class Pick which is an award that designates a restaurant with timeless appeal. And what's funny about Princes is their hours are 11am to 10pm. And the line at 10pm is usually the longest of the day, way longer than during the day. There is a national fried chicken Festival, which just happened last month in New Orleans. So, it’s an annual event. It's just about their fifth year I believe. But it happens annually now in New Orleans and Andre Prince Jeffries, the sort of matriarch of Prince’s, she was given an award to commemorate her career with the 2022 culinary Icon Award just just last month at that festival, so I wanted to mention a big congrats to them. Glad to see them getting for recognition that they deserve for pioneering Nashville.

I saw an Anthony Bourdain episode one time where he was eating the extra hot and was like begging for milk because it was just so crazy hot. So be careful. Seriously? Yeah, trying to show out in front of your friends. That's no small thing right?

Yeah, I guess that's very much some pride for some people. But you know, yeah, I would probably take their degrees seriously. 

But there is just something so nourishing and comforting and feeding people. Oh, yeah. Kind of. Yeah, this style chick food and I think that is probably the most iconic southern food BBQ too. But there's just something about fried chicken that just says the South. It does and we love just what what you were just implying that it's usually made to feed a group or a family or you know, people gathered around a table so what what better symbol of southern hospitality than that, right? Well, finally we can check this off of our list of topics. We are officially a southern podcast now right we've covered fried chicken. 

If you haven't already, like I mentioned follow us on Instagram at Steel Magnolias podcast we'll be posting some photos and videos this week. Just of fun fried chicken two videos things I'm still learning but yeah, yeah, and check out our new merch I'll link to the shop and we just can't wait to see some of you guys once you get your sweatshirts and tea towels to see them hanging in your own home. That's right. Please share those photos with that's fun to see. Well, Peace be with you, Laura Beth and also with y’all.